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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 19, 2020 2:06:12 GMT
First hitch ... $$$ ... and a minimum of 24 printed books is required for a printing, and a $14.99 monthly fee to have the book on bookblues.com/. Nevertheless: it brought the single book price for my hardcover, 6x9inch, 800 page book with 25 colour pages down to about $41US instead of around $80US as calculated on mybestseller.co.uk, where I keep the files, but private. On Lulu, this same book sold for around $120US (give or take with exchange rates changes). I'll keep researching.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Jul 20, 2020 16:48:05 GMT
The preservation of art, language ... the tangible things, ensures a culture endures the times, and also, that the future generations will be able to measure their moral principles against those that have gone before. In both ways. Indeed, but we create few sculptures, or astonishingly crafted stone buildings (modern ones will possibly eventually rust away) and a lot of art is now abstract, often only meaning something to the artist. Then again a lot of classical art is of nudes, porn for the very rich? Morals don't seem to change, just the medium it's delivered on.Personally, reading about how in the dark ages the ruling powers treated the 'peasants' (for want of a better word), burning thousands alive at the stake, because they had different ideas, (see Galileo, who survived it by a hair's breath), is a moral low I hope I will never sink to (and still: in some parts of the world, notions such as stoning to death for being the victim of a crime is equal to the dark ages mind set). Around then it was mainly the Roman Catholic Church that frowned on anything that contradicted their dogma. They set back progression hundreds of years. www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=T2ncJ6ciGyM&feature=emb_logoYet, the future is a paradox equal to none for one cannot reach into the future and flick a switch to ensure the future will turn out the way one dreams, but everything humans do is 'for the future'. At the same time, no other creature on this planet can be ruled by 'fear of future loss'. Imagine saying to a chicken: 'lay more eggs today or I won't feed you tomorrow...' It's unfortunate that many of those who have power, major industrialists, politicians, or whomsoever, only consider their own lifetimes. Poison the planet, they don't care because they will not be alive to see the results. They rarely even seem to consider the future well-being of their own offspring. Profit NOW by any means, is king.If there is one thing humans never learn, and that's learning from the past. Because few bother to learn about the past, and some of those who do, don't care, because they are too 'clever' to make the same mistakes, so they think. But, some of the things from the past, they don't consider to be mistakes. They were only a mistake to the general public. Wars, for example, can make some individuals very very rich.But what compels humans to want to leave their life's work and experience, their sum total of morals and tenets to future generations? Buggerd if I know ... Because it's in their character, and those with different morals and principles don't see any problem with them. What makes a mass-murderer? Who obviously realises it's not a trait they can really pass on to their offspring, or even tell them about.I just know that the older I get, the more I realise I need to simply please myself, and just care that I do not negatively impact on anything around me. Live as you hope others will live, but do not, and there's nowt you can do about it. One day the young will leave the nest, and need to live their own lives ... so with my art and my books: I gave them life, if they are good enough to be of interest to find incorporation in a future, they'll have found preservation. Only with your art and books? I have two grown sons. One has little interest in art or books, the other likes to read, but they have picked up respect for others, who deserve it. Bringing up offspring is far more complex than that of course.Some of my art is merely for the moment, dabblings that I enjoyed while dabbling with them - but everyone's art has at least some aspects that will be of value to future generations, if only to be a mirror on our present morals as a society. You think?Maybe Lulu's debacle is a birthing pain that will bring forth something more technologically stable than simply digital clouds. I doubt that. I think Lulu have gone the whole way in to hoping people pay them to do it for them.Mag2024 - even as we speak (type forum quick replies), there are peoples on this planet who are forced to speak a language other than their own, forced to assimilate, forced to lose their own culture ... right down to the extermination of 'uncontacted' tribes in the Amazon!; it is not a thing of the past - it has gone on since the exodus from the Rift Valley. Having said that - TODAY - 21st CENTURY, this ought not be happening according to our understanding of how 'far we've come'. We plan on populating Mars ... will future generations on Mars have to send their kids to school at night so they won't forget their Earth language? .........'nuff deeply philosophical prattling ... Forced may not be the right word. Integrate in to the world in general may be the right word. Many tribes in the Amazon, who still live as if it's the Stone Age, permission is required to even go to them to film them, and they cannot speak Spanish, never mind English. But, very often when their kids learn that perhaps as little as 100 miles away there's a city where they can get a job that does not involve shooting monkeys out of trees with poisoned darts and digging for roots, they are off like a shot, and having to learn the dominant language. Even when film crews are allowed in to see them, it's surprising to see these isolated peoples wearing Man United tops and wearing Nikes. I will not even mention the tribes that now grow drug crops for the cartels, because they have to earn a living. Also, take some African tribes. In the tourist season they can often be found dressed in traditional wear performing tribal dances. The rest of the time many are in office jobs in the towns. People do what they need to do in order to survive, not because it's (always) forced on them at gun point. Take Siberian deer farmers. During the Winter most of them now live in nice warm apartments in the nearest city. It can work the other way. Like in Wales. It was eventually forced (by burning down holiday cottages and second homes belonging to the English for example) that Welsh should be the first language taught in Welsh Schools, even to English kids who had only moved there. It's rare you hear anyone speak it though. What is our Earth language? There's 100s if not 1000s. It's to be assumed that those who go to Mars will be like those in the ISS. Many nations, who can mainly also speak English ... But most languages developed in isolation of each other. Eventually changed pronunciations over 10000s of years from some original common one. That sort of isolation no longer really exists. I doubt it will exist once Mars is colonised, either.There's that joke about Eskimos, though. What will they do when they realise the Ice Age ended?
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Jul 20, 2020 16:51:22 GMT
An interesting recently discovered fact. Most of the Amazon is growing on mulch that was originally landfill waste from long vanished civilisations. Apparently, left alone, the jungle will regrow back to how it was within a few 100 years.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Jul 20, 2020 17:09:19 GMT
Eliminating history, rewriting it, replacing culture,, language, individuality, religious beliefs to spirituality for all or nothing History is written by the victors. But thankfully rediscovered by archaeologists, even more so now with the help of tech. -- and even worse, replacing humans! Hardly. Most robots are industrial, doing highly repetitive and often highly precise jobs, such as assembling cars. If you look in, say, Toyota's main factory there's hardly a human to be seen, but they employ 370,870 people. Or doing very dangerous tasks. But it's a sad fact that a human costs a lot less than a robot to make and will still do the mundane dirty work. I was thinking, well, now we've done it; they're going to make us think all humans are infected with the virus, Er, what?! Worldwide, it's said that 14,507,491 have been infected and over half a mill died. It's not a myth or a conspiracy theory. Read some history, too, such Pandemics are nothing new. www.history.com/topics/middle-ages/pandemics-timeline all that happened after them was humans made more humans, we are far too good at that.we might as well hire robots. They're not infected. Never heard of a computer virus?It sounds preposterous now, but all this sanitizing of the world is creepy. Because it is? What sanitizing? There's still 8 billion people alive.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2020 3:41:48 GMT
Eliminating history, rewriting it, replacing culture,, language, individuality, religious beliefs to spirituality for all or nothing History is written by the victors. But thankfully rediscovered by archaeologists, even more so now with the help of tech. -- and even worse, replacing humans! Hardly. Most robots are industrial, doing highly repetitive and often highly precise jobs, such as assembling cars. If you look in, say, Toyota's main factory there's hardly a human to be seen, but they employ 370,870 people. Or doing very dangerous tasks. But it's a sad fact that a human costs a lot less than a robot to make and will still do the mundane dirty work. I was thinking, well, now we've done it; they're going to make us think all humans are infected with the virus, Er, what?! Worldwide, it's said that 14,507,491 have been infected and over half a mill died. It's not a myth or a conspiracy theory. Read some history, too, such Pandemics are nothing new. www.history.com/topics/middle-ages/pandemics-timeline all that happened after them was humans made more humans, we are far too good at that.we might as well hire robots. They're not infected. Never heard of a computer virus?It sounds preposterous now, but all this sanitizing of the world is creepy. Because it is? What sanitizing? There's still 8 billion people alive.Kevin, I have a brother and a son. Men love to debate. I, on the other hand, just like stating my opinion and moving on. Sorry, that's sexist. I take it back. The men I know love to debate. Still, as I read your post earlier today it made me smile. 😁
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tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 21, 2020 6:16:42 GMT
Mag2024 ... :-) ... I know men in my immediate surroundings (family) who love to debate, and debate, and debate - one cannot get a word in edgeways. So I know exactly what you mean ;-) And Kevin 2024 ... you said: "But, very often when their kids learn that perhaps as little as 100 miles away there's a city where they can get a job that does not involve shooting monkeys out of trees with poisoned darts and digging for roots, they are off like a shot, and having to learn the dominant language." ... yep, that's the difference, leaving one's 'home/village/country' and going to someone else's 'home/village/country', one needs to learn the dominant language - no arguments from me - but if the kids from the bush come to the city, expecting city-folk to learn the bush language, that's a bit different. It is expected that 'invaders' do that, but not 'welcome outlanders'. I did not expect any NewZealanders to learn Alemannisch, so that I could have a chinwag with them - I took it as natural that I learned English, in order to create a new life for myself, because I went to their country; if they had come to Switzerland, I would have expected them to learn one of the 4 Swiss languages, depending on where they ended up. But it's true, history is written by the victor; also: strength in numbers: integrate or vanish - mind you, I don't know how much more integrating I can do before I vanish at my age of 65 ... <grin> Aside: This tread is converging a little with this one: lulu.boards.net/thread/265/children-books Robots ... has anyone watched the British TV drama series 'HUMANS'? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humans_(TV_series) ... beware of pushing the button that switches on 'self-awareness' ... ;-) Just another thought, about archaeological discoveries: how to preserve those into the future? Is this possible at all? Especially given the thread somewhere else about how to preserve works that 'only' exist in digital form - on what media are the documentations of these archaeological finds written and archived (other than stone monuments and metal artefacts representing the find itself) - human nature tends to distort, or 'rewrite memories' to fit any given 'present way of thinking'. Maybe how we interpret archaeological finds isn't at all how it once was in reality ... reality exists in 8billion different interpretations. I'm never sure about how to integrate, and make one whole reality of, the varying ingrediences such as: appearance of solid objects, interpretation through science, veneration by religion[any], viewed with superstition, explained with mathematical equasion, or whatever else there is to interprete a solid physical object 're-discovered' after eons of having been buried since the dinosaurs walked the Earth. Maybe homo sapiens ought to have stopped overthinking life while they were on a winning streak, having just left the Rift Valley. The name 'Eskimo' is no longer in vogue ... neither is 'Laplander' ... tho for the latter the ice age has ended as the permafrost is now thawing up there ... maybe the ice age hasn't quite ended yet, and the planet is still thawing ... a few more thousand years, and the Earth's crust won't be that crusty anymore, and fly off in all directions as wads of sodden peatmoss. 'If you can think of it, it exists.'
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Post by benziger on Jul 21, 2020 20:13:34 GMT
First hitch ... $$$ ... and a minimum of 24 printed books is required for a printing, and a $14.99 monthly fee to have the book on bookblues.com/. Nevertheless: it brought the single book price for my hardcover, 6x9inch, 800 page book with 25 colour pages down to about $41US instead of around $80US as calculated on mybestseller.co.uk, where I keep the files, but private. On Lulu, this same book sold for around $120US (give or take with exchange rates changes). I'll keep researching. I would like to recommend you to have a look at epubli.de (as I know, you read also German).
784 pages A5, black/white, 25 p. colour, Softcover 32.59 € (784p. is maximum for Softcover)
800 pages A5, black/white, 25 p. colour, Hardcover 37.63 € as 'private' or with free ISBN and one item delivered to the German National Library for free one book is fine with them (but you get 10-50% reduction, starting at 25 ex. for 10%, 50% for 1000 ex. )
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 5:31:49 GMT
benziger - thanks, I am doing a test upload now. I hope 6x9inch will somehow make it - it will not be possible to reformat this text down to a trim that suits metric trims - 798 pages, must therefore be hardcover, 25 colour pages ... on mybestseller.co.uk the 6x9 would cost around Euro70 ... the book block PDF is a few years old, and has been printed by Lulu a couple of times, so should not pose problems for anyone ... pause ... just looked at the uploaded PDF - all colour images have been rendered black and white, and the choice of trim sizes is insufficient. No go.
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 5:37:16 GMT
correction: when choosing 'colour/greyscale' the images turn to colour ... ah! I can use either 'Wissenschaft', or the smaller A5, but the text is already very small ... once I chose 'colour/greyscale', the option for individual colour pages came into view. Ah ...!
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 6:20:14 GMT
The test upload gave me a book in size 2cm larger all around (Wissenschaft), for about 6 or 7 Euro more expensive than the 6x9 inch of mybestseller.co.uk - the A5 (about 1cm smaller all around) on epubli would be Euro37 (almost half the price than for the 'Wissenschaft' trim size Euro62..) then comes shipping, but that's neither here nor there just at this point.
Fazit: the new technology of individual colour page insertion is slowly making its way into POD ... good. In Australian dollars, the A5 for 800 pages in hardcover with 25 colour pages would cost about AUD$60, also good, much better than the AUD$170 or thereabouts from Lulu.com just recently, in all colour paper, with the misprinted cover (they refunded, thank goodness). I'm just a little worried that the font size for the 'shrunk' text block from 6x9inch to A5 will be too small - nevertheless, epubli.de is promising, if a little limited in sizes - having said that, Lulu.com is going the same way ... limited sizes.
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 6:25:59 GMT
the other way around ... doh ... the epubli.de trim size 'Wissenschaft' gives me a book worth E62.23, while on mybestseller.co.uk the 6x9inch costs E69.82 ... above text should read '...about 6 or 7 Euro LESS expensive...' (my bad) - going through the exercise, epubli.de is cheaper, tho does not give me the 6x9inch.
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 6:44:34 GMT
Last but not least - Australia is not on their list of countries, and they don't take paypal. I've given up credit cards long ago, not good for my health. The two printers I found in the US also don't ship outside US ... doh ... so far only the Dutch outfit ticks those boxes, too.
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Post by tasmanianartistNotLoggedIn on Jul 22, 2020 9:22:27 GMT
What a shame: "leider können wir derzeit in der Tat keine Lieferung nach Australien vornehmen. Auch eine Zahlung per PayPal können wir derzeit noch nicht anbieten. Es tut uns Leid, dass wir Ihnen in diesem Fall nicht weiterhelfen können." Egad...
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Post by benziger on Jul 24, 2020 11:22:55 GMT
nevertheless, epubli.de is promising, if a little limited in sizes - having said that, Lulu.com is going the same way ... limited sizes. What I like most, they offer large (A4), medium (A5) and small (A6) sizes also in landscape format. To my knowledge for this they are unique. Unfortunately (for me) only with their ISBN. I've given up credit cards long ago, not good for my health. In Switzerland, credit cards were always very expensive and everyone only needed debit cards. Or ordered on account, payable within 30 days at the post office counter. With the Internet, it became a bit difficult with foreign sites. My compromise looks like this: Since my supermarket (in fact, both do it) offers free credit cards, I have one. But it's in the desk drawer with the access documents for e-banking. So if there is no other way, I can take it and pay like this. Sometimes it takes several months before the credit card company sends me a new statement. I would never buy on credit in everyday life. I wouldn't be able to keep track.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Jul 25, 2020 1:05:13 GMT
Kevin, I have a brother and a son. Men love to debate. As do some females. I, on the other hand, just like stating my opinion and moving on. That does seem to be a common habit, but at least you move on. Some keep repeating it against all evidence.Sorry, that's sexist. I take it back. Not sure how it is sexist unless you are saying no females like to debate. The men I know love to debate. It's Ok as long as all they debate about is not football. I find many males boring Still, as I read your post earlier today it made me smile See, I do have my uses.
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