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Post by Retread-Retired-Cameron on Dec 16, 2022 19:16:21 GMT
My apologies.
This link to Mermaid Publishing has been posted six times under 3 different but similar usernames. From my end, it appears to be a legitimate company until one starts reading the information on their website, which reads like an AI voice, cobbled from lists of buzzwords.
The information on their street addresses in US and UK are images, not text. I smell fish. Hatchet falling... Looks like I'll watch for replacement clones.
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sirram
Senior Printer
No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
Posts: 269
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Post by sirram on Dec 18, 2022 14:04:53 GMT
... Lulu's pricing calculator (https://www.lulu.com/pricing) originally showed me a list price of GBP 12.13 for this 612-page A5 paperback. But the "Pricing & Payees" screen is instead showing a "Minimum price" of GBP 24.26 - basically they have doubled the price. I give up !!! We have sold well over 2,500 books since starting with Lulu in 2014. I will recommend to our committee to leave the existing books with Lulu's global distribution as even Lulu hasn't yet managed to corrupt them. However, we will NOT use Lulu for any new books. I have been trying to get this project off the ground for many months, firstly baulked by various currency bugs, and now this .... I decided to raise a ticket with Lulu Support re: the doubling up of the List Price from GBP 12.13 to GBP 24.26. Lulu's explanation is that, with Global Distribution, the print cost is still GBP 12.13 but the distribution fee is another 12.13 GBP on top. Pricey but now explained. But there is a new sting. Even though the List Price via global distribution becomes prohibitively expensive, I thought I could at least lower it for copies purchased from the Lulu bookstore. But this turns out to be impossible. According to Lulu Support, one can't have a different (i.e. lower) price in the Lulu Bookstore. You will see this from the screenshot below. In this (just a test) example, my revenue from the Lulu bookstore would be GBP 9.70 but GBP 0.00 for the same book purchased from Amazon. So, if I use an ISBN (and select Global Distribution), the book will be too expensive, even if purchased direct from Lulu.
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Post by potet on Dec 18, 2022 15:58:46 GMT
This is true. If you accept Global Distribution the price has to be raised for the author to make even a modest profit. The consequence is that the Global Distribution price becomes that of the Lulu Bookstore. If you want your book to be sold at an affordable price with a good profit, the only solution is to have a single distributor - the Lulu Bookstore.
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sirram
Senior Printer
No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
Posts: 269
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Post by sirram on Dec 18, 2022 17:02:17 GMT
I rather thought so. I will discuss this with my committee. Our main sales are from stock which our publications officer orders from Lulu - and which we then sell via our own website. So long as that price is acceptable, I think we can probably go ahead.
I will do a pretend order.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 19, 2022 0:34:08 GMT
My apologies.
This link to Mermaid Publishing has been posted six times under 3 different but similar usernames. From my end, it appears to be a legitimate company until one starts reading the information on their website, which reads like an AI voice, cobbled from lists of buzzwords.
The information on their street addresses in US and UK are images, not text. I smell fish. Hatchet falling... Looks like I'll watch for replacement clones. They do see a bit odd. Even not to be trusted if they spam a forum as publicity. Short of work? I Googled them. All the links came up not to be trusted, apart from what seems to be them on faceache. www.facebook.com/mermaidpublishers/ plus this www.facebook.com/mermaidpublishers/reviews/?ref=page_internal hrmmm. And this >> www.trustpilot.com/review/mermaidpublishers.com which I am surprised trustpilot's tools have not noticed all use the same style and words.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 19, 2022 0:49:40 GMT
Lulu never used to charge a 'distribution fee'. ISBNs were free and so was Global. Just what are they distributing? Usually just digital files to a POD printing company, which is all done, or was all done, by auto software, who in fact may already have the files if the book/s have been printed before by that company. Or the digital files for the cover image and possibly a Preview, to places that list the books for sale. It's as if they are charging to distribute physical books to retailers. But even so, the retailers would pay shipping, just as any one who ordered one or more does. They are really doubling the price for nothing. Perhaps what Lulu mean is you have to add that on in order to make any money, because Amazon etc., will add on their profit. Print cost, say $10 + retailer's profit, say another $10. If one sets the price at $20, you don't make a bean. It's nothing to do with distribution, it's simply that retailers will not list a book as a charity to us poor writers.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 19, 2022 1:00:28 GMT
One problem with only using Lulu's Storefront is Lulu do not advertise that they actually have books for sale on their site. You have to tell people your books are there to buy. Links from your own site, from facebook, from reviews, even from adverts. Even within your own books (Also available ...) It's always surprised me that Lulu do not advertise their storefront section. It was often suggested to them. Is it not also in their own interests to do so? or do they not want to be associated with many of the books self-published via Lulu? If that's the case then perhaps their free ISBNs should not get tagged with Lulu as the actual publisher? Which is mentioned on retail sites, such as Amazon.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 19, 2022 1:04:48 GMT
Lulu did at one time have a discount tool. It only worked on the Storefronts, even if you used Global. Which dismayed many people who raised their price simply to discount it when they discovered their 'falsely' raised price would not go out all over the net
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sirram
Senior Printer
No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
Posts: 269
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Post by sirram on Dec 19, 2022 14:49:00 GMT
This is true. If you accept Global Distribution the price has to be raised for the author to make even a modest profit. The consequence is that the Global Distribution price becomes that of the Lulu Bookstore. If you want your book to be sold at an affordable price with a good profit, the only solution is to have a single distributor - the Lulu Bookstore. I have had another idea. Publish it twice - one version with an ISBN (to get Global Distribution) and the other without an ISBN. I have just published my test version (with ISBN), which (as above) shows a List Price of GBP 24.26. While still logged on, I went to order a proof copy (in the normal way). And, despite the advertised List Price of GBP 24.26, Lulu will sell copies to me (as author) for the lower price of GBP 12.13 (+ delivery charges of course). Since we sell most of our books via our own website (rather than via Amazon), we would stock up on the lower-cost (non-ISBN version) and advertise it there with a List Price of, say, GBP 13.50 (we are not seeking huge revenues). The other version (with ISBN) would be available via Global Distribution if anyone wanted to pay the high price and were unaware of our website. Having an ISBN version is important as it would continue to be available over the Internet and would also be stored at the major UK copyright repositories (e.g. The British Library). Publishing only to the Lulu bookstore would be a little pointless as no-one even knows it's there. BTW, I didn't actually order the proof copy. Having completed the test, I quickly backed out and have retired it.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 20, 2022 1:08:42 GMT
Ah, so you do have a website, I was not sure. To save you paying for shipping to carry stock to fill your own orders, why not have links from the books mentioned on your site to Lulu for people to buy from, that way they pay the shipping. Lulu in days of yore provided free marketing tools, and one was an editable link from writers'/publishers' sites direct to Lulu. It did in fact say Buy. The link was hidden within the button. It is common in fact. Many buy now buttons on sites lead to Amazon.
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sirram
Senior Printer
No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
Posts: 269
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Post by sirram on Dec 20, 2022 14:46:15 GMT
... To save you paying for shipping to carry stock to fill your own orders, why not have links from the books mentioned on your site to Lulu for people to buy from, that way they pay the shipping .... Thanks for the suggestion but there are a few snags. To take another of our books as an example, the Global Distribution price is GBP 7.50 (+ shipping) but if we purchase copies while logged in, Lulu only charge us GBP 3.10 (+ shipping). We then sell these copies via the website for GBP 7.50 (+ shipping), which earns us revenue. Secondly, as we order ten or twenty copies at a time, the "+ shipping" element becomes less significant per copy. We also only place orders when Lulu has one of it discounts on offer. Thirdly, we sell a lot of copies locally, which means purchasers can drop round to pick up their order. We also sell books at meetings and at locally held events. Finally, I think that if a potential purchaser came across our website only to be told to visit Lulu, I suspect some wouldn't bother.
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Post by And Kevin 2024 on Dec 21, 2022 2:43:36 GMT
... To save you paying for shipping to carry stock to fill your own orders, why not have links from the books mentioned on your site to Lulu for people to buy from, that way they pay the shipping .... Thanks for the suggestion but there are a few snags. To take another of our books as an example, the Global Distribution price is GBP 7.50 (+ shipping) but if we purchase copies while logged in, Lulu only charge us GBP 3.10 (+ shipping). Lulu's shipping prices are normally quite high. Although it's not actually Lulu's, it's who ever prints it, passed on to Lulu. 3.10 sound cheap. how many pages it that?We then sell these copies via the website for GBP 7.50 (+ shipping), which earns us revenue. I get your point, but you still have to have paid shipping to get it to you. Then you have to fill the order. I assume your labour is not free? Time is money! Why not, as suggested by someone, create a version with no ISBN or Global? (Actually, the ISBN of the one with Global can still be quoted on the copyright page of the one that is not.) That way you can have one priced on Lulu at, let's say £5, you still make a reasonable profit, and no shipping costs. Just point potential buyers to the Lulu page it's on. Or of course you can still sell the non-global one listed on Lulu at 7.50 if you wish. Let Lulu do the work and you get your profit for less effort.Secondly, as we order ten or twenty copies at a time, the "+ shipping" element becomes less significant per copy. I guess that's true.We also only place orders when Lulu has one of it discounts on offer. Which seems to be all the time now! But is irrelevant to you if people buy direct from Lulu. I assume that Lulu offer 'bulk' printing prices? Over a certain number the cost starts to fall. Or they did, I am not too sure nowadays.Thirdly, we sell a lot of copies locally, which means purchasers can drop round to pick up their order. We also sell books at meetings and at locally held events. You can do that also of course. Just what exactly are your books?Finally, I think that if a potential purchaser came across our website only to be told to visit Lulu, I suspect some wouldn't bother. They are not exactly being told. They way I did it, and the way many do it, is to have a description of the book and an image of the cover (or even any product) and under that a button, or even just hypertext, saying something like, to see a Preview and to purchase this book, click here. It's not a lot different to having an Add To Basket button, because that often takes you at least to another page. Clicking it took people to Amazon. It was a hidden web-address. At times I had a few Click Here 'links' naming different places people could buy from. Not everyone likes Amazon! It was very easy to create such site's pages and a site using a WYSIWYG web builder.
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Post by adrianallan on Dec 21, 2022 9:14:39 GMT
Hi Sirram
I have followed this thread with interest. I have just successfully made the transition from Lulu to Amazon KDP publishing. My latest book is 636 pages long and is selling well - you can look me up on Amazon. IF you want any help of advice on the pros and cons of Amazon (as opposed to Lulu, who I have now abandoned), you are welcome to give me a ring. I am based in the UK, which I suspect you are, too. Maybe send me a private message on here.
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sirram
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No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
Posts: 269
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Post by sirram on Dec 21, 2022 14:09:35 GMT
Hi Sirram I have followed this thread with interest. I have just successfully made the transition from Lulu to Amazon KDP publishing. My latest book is 636 pages long and is selling well - you can look me up on Amazon. IF you want any help of advice on the pros and cons of Amazon (as opposed to Lulu, who I have now abandoned), you are welcome to give me a ring. I am based in the UK, which I suspect you are, too. Maybe send me a private message on here. A very kind offer. But you could always first summarise the highlights and lowlights on this forum as I'm sure everyone else will be enormously interested as well.
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sirram
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No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money
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Post by sirram on Dec 21, 2022 14:50:11 GMT
In case you all go colour blind, my original comments are in black, replies from " Still me" are in blue and my responses are in a rather fetching shade of brown. Thanks for the suggestion but there are a few snags. To take another of our books as an example, the Global Distribution price is GBP 7.50 (+ shipping) but if we purchase copies while logged in, Lulu only charge us GBP 3.10 (+ shipping). Lulu's shipping prices are normally quite high. Although it's not actually Lulu's, it's who ever prints it, passed on to Lulu. 3.10 sound cheap. how many pages it that?The book is 96 pages, A5, paperback, standard paper, glossy cover.
We then sell these copies via the website for GBP 7.50 (+ shipping), which earns us revenue. I get your point, but you still have to have paid shipping to get it to you. Then you have to fill the order. I assume your labour is not free? Time is money! Why not, as suggested by someone, create a version with no ISBN or Global? (Actually, the ISBN of the one with Global can still be quoted on the copyright page of the one that is not.) That way you can have one priced on Lulu at, let's say £5, you still make a reasonable profit, and no shipping costs. Just point potential buyers to the Lulu page it's on. Or of course you can still sell the non-global one listed on Lulu at 7.50 if you wish. Let Lulu do the work and you get your profit for less effort.
We are a not-for-profit local-history society and we are all volunteers. We do it for pleasure and to promote knowledge of local history in our area. Our Publications Officer enjoys stocking up and fulfilling orders.
I do like the idea of including the ISBN of the copyright page of the non-"Global" version - and also bar-coded on the back cover. I hadn't thought of that. Essentially the two versions would be identical except only one would be for Global Distribution.
Secondly, as we order ten or twenty copies at a time, the "+ shipping" element becomes less significant per copy. I guess that's true.We also only place orders when Lulu has one of it discounts on offer. Which seems to be all the time now! But is irrelevant to you if people buy direct from Lulu. I assume that Lulu offer 'bulk' printing prices? Over a certain number the cost starts to fall. Or they did, I am not too sure nowadays.
Reflecting again on this point, I think we would prefer to continue to fulfil orders ourselves that come in via the website (with Global Distribution also providing another source of sales). I will however mention the Lulu idea to our Pubs. Officer as the call will be down to her.
Thirdly, we sell a lot of copies locally, which means purchasers can drop round to pick up their order. We also sell books at meetings and at locally held events. You can do that also of course. Just what exactly are your books?
They are all local-history books - developed, edited and published by us as a society.Finally, I think that if a potential purchaser came across our website only to be told to visit Lulu, I suspect some wouldn't bother. They are not exactly being told. They way I did it, and the way many do it, is to have a description of the book and an image of the cover (or even any product) and under that a button, or even just hypertext, saying something like, to see a Preview and to purchase this book, click here. It's not a lot different to having an Add To Basket button, because that often takes you at least to another page. Clicking it took people to Amazon. It was a hidden web-address. At times I had a few Click Here 'links' naming different places people could buy from. Not everyone likes Amazon! It was very easy to create such site's pages and a site using a WYSIWYG web builder.
Yes, I get your idea now. At present, we have a summary list of our books and a detailed web page for each one, including front-cover image, synopsis and metadata. The "click to buy a copy" button currently takes the prospective purchaser to a contact form which I built into our website. This is auto-forwarded to our Pubs. Officer.
I can see that these could be changed to forward to the Lulu bookstore. The trouble is I no longer trust Lulu given the numerous bugs after they migrated to their new software platform. We need to keep control of non "Global Distribution" book sales, rather than trust Lulu.
I'd be forever having to run a "broken link" checker in case Lulu changes the URLs on its website.
The above ideas have certainly provided food for thought.
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